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Voyou San
an article i found that i thought might present some decent discussion. Apparently this man thinks the american man needs to grow up and stop causing all the problems in this world. Suprised its not written by a lady, or mabye it is but she hides behind the name of a man!!!! so what do yall think? I personall think this guy can shove it.. so i play video games, plenty of people raise kids and play video games. Just because I have kids, does not mean i have to give up what i enjoy doing..

QUOTE
CLICK ME FOR LINK

Divorce and illegitimate births have reached epidemic proportions. A society whose grown men seem to be more interested in the latest video game, rather than the survival of their nation or even of their own family--is doomed to failure.

Three years ago, as the latest Star Wars movie opened, local television stations sent out camera crews to film the throngs camped-out all night for tickets. What struck me was the age of the average fanatic. In every city (including my own), all I saw were grown men ranging in age from their late 20's well into their 40's. The comments from these overgrown 12 year olds were as absurd as their very presence at the mega-plexes. How can a grown man be so consumed (or even content) with the 21st century equivalent of comic books?

What do you think the ratio of grown men watching football on Sunday is to grown men spending time with their children on that same day?...Sorry, staring at the idiot box together doesn't count!

When I was a child, I remember that all grown men worked and financially supported their family, as there was a terrible stigma attached to loafers. I don't believe I ever saw a grown man during the day, unless he was working. That work ethic not only built this country, but allowed women to raise the children and provide the much needed nurturing with which she was naturally equipped.

Considering the high rate of divoce, out-of-wedlock births, and absentee fathers--adult American men are shirking their responsibilities and seem to be somehow regressing.

In 2005, there were a staggering 1.5 million illegitimate births within the United States. In fact, 40 percent of all births were to single women. In the black community, the rate of illegitimacy is an incredible 70 percent. If we want to see the havoc that can be wrought by useless fathers--we need look no further than poverty stricken black neighborhoods.


Some sobering statistics are provided by the National Center for Health Statistics. According to their latest study on the subject, fatherless homes account for:

63% of childhood suicides

90% of runaway children

71% of high school dropouts

85% of incarcerated minors

50 % of teen mothers

Once upon a time in America divorce was very rare. It was a drastic step only taken when abuse was occurring inside the marriage. That is exactly as it should be. However, by 1997 an incredible 80 percent of divorces were attributed to so-called "irreconcilable differences" (i.e. we're bored!).

Today, half of all new marriages will end in divorce. According to U.S. Census Bureau figures: The average age of Americans at their first divorce is 30 for men, and 29 for women. We have all heard of the "quickie divorce", once only obtained in the state of Nevada...It has apparently given way to the "quickie marriage." Of course, it is always the children who suffer as a result of such irresponsible behavior.

We have known for sometime that children raised in single-parent homes are much more susceptible to poverty, a life of crime, and of course to repeat the irresponsible behavior of their parents. It is time for the American man to put down the remote, stop allowing other men to raise his children, and devote himself to his family.

The lazy and disconnected American man is much more of a threat to the survival of this nation, than are the Muslim terrorists seeking their 72 virgins in heaven.
Dragon Brigade
What did those statistics even have to do with video games or watching tv? He does have a point, what with there being an obvious lack of ethic morality in quite a few people these days, but quite frankly I don’t see how that had anything to do with watching a sci-fi movie or playing a game. I dunno. He seems to be arguing too many things at once, and it’s obviously not working. I do agree with him when he says that there is a lot of irresponsible behavior (aka: lack of proper ethics), and people do need to shape up, but I definitely don’t agree with how he approached it, or even how he was arguing it. He just sounds awfully biased, and it really doesn’t help if someone is trying to take him seriously.

Oh well. And, haha, this wouldn’t have been written by a woman, Voyou. =p. It would have most likely been geared more towards domestic abuse, etc., not complaining about how a video game twists someone’s mind. Television does that. >.o.
Voyou San
true but everything is pointing towards the man, and not the woman. Pretty much saying that women dont play video games or watch sci-fi movies or anything bad... so a woman totally wrote it smile.gif
Dragon Brigade
Psh, no, of course women don’t do anything wrong. Women don’t even play video games. They go shopping and buy more clothes than they’d ever need to wear.
Theferrell
QUOTE
We have all heard of the "quickie divorce", once only obtained in the state of Nevada...It has apparently given way to the "quickie marriage." Of course, it is always the children who suffer as a result of such irresponsible behavior.


I thought BYU only had the problem of quickie marriages.... (If you don't go to BYU, you probably won't get it in the way I'm saying it...)

But, she does make a good point about illegitimate births and screwed up homes. I too fail to see how video games/sci-fi movies lead men to divorce their wives within this article... but homes without fathers tend to become more screwed up than not. (Saw it first hand in the slums of Jersey myself.) I think this lady should stop beating around the bush, blaming things that don't directly lead to divorce (a.k.a. video games) and attack the most common causes of divorce (husbands not getting jobs, promiscuity on both ends, drugs alcohol etc...) Those are the things that screw up families more than video games. I mean, my fiance just bought the first whole season of Stargate SG-1. I believe that biased liberal femminists should not have a say WRT videogames and Sci-fi... gah.gif

(edit after looking at real article)
WHOA. IT WAS A DUDE WHO WROTE IT!!!!! (unless there's women named Dave nowadays...)
This guy doesn't deserve to have his man-parts. He dissed Football!!!!!
Noir
"Hey, I'm going to point out obvious faults in America and blame them on something that could be related without proving a connection, all the while generalizing the masses based upon a small minority. Nobody has EVER done that before"

What a stupid bastard.
The Evil Dead
Who gives a ####.

It's the progression of society. It's how it goes. We're not going to be going back to " ME MAN, ME HUNT " Anytime soon. I'd say he's making valid points but the 50's died out a long time ago and as always in societies, things are a changin'.

Now back to WoW, Working, and not giving a ##### about anything. Oh yeah, I have a job and pay all my bills too. We're not all loafers.
Voyou San
QUOTE (The Evil Dead @ Mar 27 2008, 03:02 PM) *
Now back to WoW, Working, and not giving a ##### about anything. Oh yeah, I have a job and pay all my bills too. We're not all loafers.


UH AMEN!!
Noir
All Indians own a casino.
Bomb
I might be a bad reader--this is very possible--but where does he mention video games at all? A lot of us in here are being all like "Hey man, back off of video games," but I don't see where he takes a shot at games specifically, just Star Wars.
And let's face it, Star Wars is responsible for a lot of terrorist actions and other social tragedies.

(Though to conteract it, Star Wars has been an extremely effective birth control...)
Dragon Brigade
QUOTE
CLICK ME FOR LINK

Divorce and illegitimate births have reached epidemic proportions. A society whose grown men seem to be more interested in the latest video game, rather than the survival of their nation or even of their own family--is doomed to failure.


QUOTE
What do you think the ratio of grown men watching football on Sunday is to grown men spending time with their children on that same day?...Sorry, staring at the idiot box together doesn't count!


QUOTE
We have known for sometime that children raised in single-parent homes are much more susceptible to poverty, a life of crime, and of course to repeat the irresponsible behavior of their parents. It is time for the American man to put down the remote, stop allowing other men to raise his children, and devote himself to his family.



QUOTE (Bomb @ Mar 30 2008, 01:30 PM) *
I might be a bad reader--this is very possible--but where does he mention video games at all? A lot of us in here are being all like "Hey man, back off of video games," but I don't see where he takes a shot at games specifically, just Star Wars.
And let's face it, Star Wars is responsible for a lot of terrorist actions and other social trageties.

(Though to conteract it, Star Wars has been an extremely effective birth control...)



Actually, you're right, he doesn't really specifically point out video games. He only mentions it once in the opening paragraph, but otherwise it's maybe one or two jabs at men being lazy bums staring at the television all day; which, really, could be playing video games too, but that wasn't quite what he was getting at. It's more the fact that he would link it (however loosely) to bad parenting/irresponsible males that might irk people. If he's going to link it to that sort of thing, he might as well explain it better, instead of putting it down as if it's just one of those "understood things" of life.

...If that makes sense. That's just my take on it, dunno about anybody else. But yeah, he didn't really specifically take a shot at games.
Medvedev
Is that about US only? Maybe it belongs to some other countries?
Dragon Brigade
@Medvedev: The author states he meant it just for America/U.S.
Athrun
According to my latest study on the subject, fatherless homes account for:

99% making Linkin Park AMV clips on youtube.
37% cosplaying as Sephiroth.
70% making Facebook and Myspace accounts.
85% have caught all 493 pokemon.
LagunaWannabe
Haha wtf... I pretty much disagree with the article on a few different points.

QUOTE
Divorce and illegitimate births have reached epidemic proportions


Divorce and illegitimate births are a two way street. Women must say "yes" in order to marry the guy, and she has just as much responsibility to make him wear a condom. You can't pin something like that on just the males (unless ur talking rape or something, but that doesnt count for a large percentage of illegitimate births).

QUOTE
Three years ago, as the latest Star Wars movie opened, local television stations sent out camera crews to film the throngs camped-out all night for tickets. What struck me was the age of the average fanatic. In every city (including my own), all I saw were grown men ranging in age from their late 20's well into their 40's.


Yeah no sh*t. It's because when the original Star Wars movies came out, these guys were in their teens. And so of course for nostalgic purposes they go see the movie. IT's like taking a poll of what age ppl are playing FF7: Crisis Core and buying hte movie. I bet it's a lot of ppl i their twenties because when the game first came out they were younger fans.

QUOTE
What do you think the ratio of grown men watching football on Sunday is to grown men spending time with their children on that same day?...


That has nothing to do with anything anyways. It's not like football lasts 24 hours of the Sunday, and that doesn't mean they dont spend the other 6 days of the week with their children.

QUOTE
Considering the high rate of divoce, out-of-wedlock births, and absentee fathers--adult American men are shirking their responsibilities and seem to be somehow regressing.


He's restating something he already said. ANd like I already said, it's a two way street.

And for the rest of the article they keep going on and on on statistics about households without fathers or about divorce. Seriously, the stereotype is that it's the guys fault, and a lot of times it can be, but in this country, the American women tends to strike at the wallet, so divorce is a great way get a free cut of some guy's check.

It really is a two way street. If they want better divorce rates, kids should be raised learning that divorce is really bad, and in order for that to happen, the mother and father need to stay together, and in order for that to happen, they BOTH need to make smart decisions about who they're spending their life with.

Good attempt at an article, doesn't fly with me tho
Grahf
was this written by some guy that just woke up from a coma that he's been in since the 50's? These changes aren't really abrupt. Mentioning Star Wars like that is ridiculous, movies that people camp outside theaters for is very rare, and it shows when the author says "three years ago". If this were a common thing, then there would be many more recent examples for this author to mention.

Also, saying football is "ruining families" is ridiculous. Sunday football isn't exactly a new thing, and even if it does take up the whole day, thats a single day out of a 7 day week.

If men are supposed to be constantly at work, then I expect women to constantly be at home, doing laundry, cooking, or taking care of kids and I want my dinner to be ready as soon as I get home. This isn't the 50's, Dave, so stop making 50's stereotypes.

Finally, these statistics might be correct, but blaming all of these problems on men alone is just ridiculous. Either this guy doesn't think women are capable of making decisions on their own, or he is just really anti-male.

This article isn't biased or anything.
Seluna
The article writer generalized and pulled in his own biased opinions, and in doing so, he didn't make his point cleanly and clearly. He's just pointing fingers by staring at statistics. Surely not all American males are couch potatoes who love soccer, and are also irresponsible sperm machines, some good percentage of them actually capable of influencing ladies (most likely not very bright ones) to marry them, then proceeded to dump said ladies after that? And that the ladies are completely blameless and are the 'woe-is-me' victims?

And when the article writer was young and men are out working, wasn't it because the career women were not exactly the most popular option? And who's to say that those men that were hard at work during the day would be responsible fathers and husbands when they get home, and they absolutely will not practise domestic violence or daily pilgrimage to the local pub or whatever place they gather for their favorite pastime?

And worse, I seriously don't think that liking a '21st century equivalent of comic books' has anything to do with the above faults that he claim the average or all american males have.

Wanting to point out whatever is wrong with the society today and if there are possible solutions may not be a bad thing, but he/she sure as hell picked a lousy way to go about doing it. And I'm not hundred percent certain that he is actually a 'he', considering how much of a feminist he/she is. Even I don't think that the male population in general is that bad.
Theferrell
QUOTE (Athrun @ Mar 30 2008, 06:51 PM) *
According to my latest study on the subject, fatherless homes account for:

99% making Linkin Park AMV clips on youtube.
37% cosplaying as Sephiroth.
70% making Facebook and Myspace accounts.
85% have caught all 493 pokemon.


laugh.gif laugh.gif laugh.gif
And where did you get this fantastic study material???? smile.gif

QUOTE
If men are supposed to be constantly at work, then I expect women to constantly be at home, doing laundry, cooking, or taking care of kids and I want my dinner to be ready as soon as I get home. This isn't the 50's, Dave, so stop making 50's stereotypes.


@ Grahf: It's sad that there's a whole department at my University that aims to reinforce this mentality in women by allowing them to "be at peace" with being your stereotypical stay at home mom with a "university" degree that is absloutley worthless. It's called the "Marriage, Family, Human Development" degree. We call it the "Mommy" major. smile.gif
Cel Merion
http://www.city-journal.org/2008/18_1_single_young_men.html

I came across this and thought it might fit the topic. Basically some bitch complains about men not breaking their backs like they used to. I'ld post the article but it's like 40 paragraphs of the stuff so..meh.
LagunaWannabe
QUOTE
Surely not all American males are couch potatoes who love soccer,


lol @ Seluna

American Male, Football = American Football for SUNDAY GRIDIRON WOOHOOO. None of the foot fair soccer that the rest of the world likes tongue.gif

jk bout foot fairies
Seluna
QUOTE (LagunaWannabe @ Apr 1 2008, 01:56 AM) *
QUOTE
Surely not all American males are couch potatoes who love soccer,


lol @ Seluna

American Male, Football = American Football for SUNDAY GRIDIRON WOOHOOO. None of the foot fair soccer that the rest of the world likes tongue.gif

jk bout foot fairies

Ahh... sorry, I forgot that the national sports of USA is football, not soccer. I get mixed up all the time because I'm not interested in both of those sports. But you get my point, don't ya?
-Vincent-
Americans are spoiled, and that is a fact. Both men and women. Another problem with Americans is that they think that if they feel a crush, they think it's for life, and make a huge mistake. Divorce is justified, though marriage shouldn't exist at all. If people want to be together, they should simply be together until they're ready to part, or are not ready to part.

Also, games are an addiction, and they can surely cause negligence. Star Wars is fictional, and I don't see a reason why people should gather somewhere and wait for hours for some Star Wars event. Why not wait for the damn movie to go out of theaters, and rent it? Football, soccer, SPORTS! This is a biased opinion, but what the hell is interesting in watching people run after a ball, hit a ball or whatever? Wouldn't it be better for YOU to go out and do something instead of scratch your big, beer belly in front of a TV? Go OUT and drink, people. Take that accumulated, prosaic anger out with friends. Drink until they carry you home. Then go back to your activities. Constructive activities.

But all of this is just talk. What you Americans need is devastation. You need a hectic war on YOUR turf. Then you'd maybe, just maybe grow up a little. Then your smirk will be gone, your ignorance and indelicacy cured.

There are exceptions among Americans though, but exceptions never do matter. It's always about the majority.
Theferrell
QUOTE (-Vincent- @ Apr 3 2008, 02:03 AM) *
Americans are spoiled, and that is a fact. Both men and women. Another problem with Americans is that they think that if they feel a crush, they think it's for life, and make a huge mistake. Divorce is justified, though marriage shouldn't exist at all. If people want to be together, they should simply be together until they're ready to part, or are not ready to part.

Also, games are an addiction, and they can surely cause negligence. Star Wars is fictional, and I don't see a reason why people should gather somewhere and wait for hours for some Star Wars event. Why not wait for the damn movie to go out of theaters, and rent it? Football, soccer, SPORTS! This is a biased opinion, but what the hell is interesting in watching people run after a ball, hit a ball or whatever? Wouldn't it be better for YOU to go out and do something instead of scratch your big, beer belly in front of a TV? Go OUT and drink, people. Take that accumulated, prosaic anger out with friends. Drink until they carry you home. Then go back to your activities. Constructive activities.

But all of this is just talk. What you Americans need is devastation. You need a hectic war on YOUR turf. Then you'd maybe, just maybe grow up a little. Then your smirk will be gone, your ignorance and indelicacy cured.

There are exceptions among Americans though, but exceptions never do matter. It's always about the majority.


Wow, thank you Hollywood for telling the rest of the world how "Americans" are like...


Lemme explain a little...

QUOTE
Another problem with Americans is that they think that if they feel a crush, they think it's for life, and make a huge mistake.


That may happen at my University, but as a whole, Americans have been reported to have lower marriage rates and more co-habitation tendencies because of commitment. The big problem is those who feel that they don't have to be "married" to start a family and those who just simply live together without marriage because there is no real linking bond between the man and woman. That causes more broken homes than people who "feel it's a crush..."

QUOTE
This is a biased opinion, but what the hell is interesting in watching people run after a ball, hit a ball or whatever? Wouldn't it be better for YOU to go out and do something instead of scratch your big, beer belly in front of a TV? Go OUT and drink, people.


This is a whole topic in and of itself, but there's plenty of people who watch sports casually. There's a lot of people who view it as a hobby such as fishing or surfing. And also, just to clarify, I watched a whole season of Football for the first time this year (Fiance is a Cowboys fan), and never drank one beer. (Well, I've never drunken alcohol in my life...)

QUOTE
But all of this is just talk. What you Americans need is devastation. You need a hectic war on YOUR turf. Then you'd maybe, just maybe grow up a little. Then your smirk will be gone, your ignorance and indelicacy cured.


Hey, we've already had those. Revolutionary War, Civil War, 911. Granted that our states get along with each other (with the exemption of Northern California and Southern California:)), we generally don't have any in-fighting except for small-scale exceptions such as gang fights and stupid people being racist.

Please, don't base the United States from what you see in stereotypical shows on TV and the movies. They make money exploiting stereotypes that makes the average American white guy a fat moron who just drinks beer and watches football.
The Evil Dead
QUOTE (-Vincent- @ Apr 3 2008, 03:03 AM) *
Americans are spoiled, and that is a fact. Both men and women. Another problem with Americans is that they think that if they feel a crush, they think it's for life, and make a huge mistake. Divorce is justified, though marriage shouldn't exist at all. If people want to be together, they should simply be together until they're ready to part, or are not ready to part.

Also, games are an addiction, and they can surely cause negligence. Star Wars is fictional, and I don't see a reason why people should gather somewhere and wait for hours for some Star Wars event. Why not wait for the damn movie to go out of theaters, and rent it? Football, soccer, SPORTS! This is a biased opinion, but what the hell is interesting in watching people run after a ball, hit a ball or whatever? Wouldn't it be better for YOU to go out and do something instead of scratch your big, beer belly in front of a TV? Go OUT and drink, people. Take that accumulated, prosaic anger out with friends. Drink until they carry you home. Then go back to your activities. Constructive activities.

But all of this is just talk. What you Americans need is devastation. You need a hectic war on YOUR turf. Then you'd maybe, just maybe grow up a little. Then your smirk will be gone, your ignorance and indelicacy cured.

There are exceptions among Americans though, but exceptions never do matter. It's always about the majority.


What is this bush league BS?

My favorite part:

QUOTE
Wouldn't it be better for YOU to go out and do something instead of scratch your big, beer belly in front of a TV? Go OUT and drink, people. Take that accumulated, prosaic anger out with friends. Drink until they carry you home.


You know that's great that you want to have your say but a lot of what you're saying doesn't make a whole lot of sense. I work 40-50 hours a week, will be going to school soon, and you know what, I like to sit on my ass and play video games and hang out... And I DO go out and drink with friends often, among other things... So what the ##### is your point? Drink until we're stupid so we forget about our troubles ( Kinda like Prozac... ) become " Constructive " the next day at work? Not a bit of what you're saying really makes any sense.

As far as devastation, I think our economy is fairly devastating right now. At least to me. I work hard and as our dollar becomes more and more worthless it's very harmful to our country. I mean, economic collapse is a nasty thing. If there were any long and drawn out war on my turf I'd probably leave this country. I don't owe the states anything... I was just kinda born here into a lower/middleclass single parent family and haven't made my way out yet. smile.gif

And thank you for being mature enough to wish war and devastation upon our country, Vincent. Very nice of you ohmy.gif.
-Vincent-
@Theferrel -- Some Americans from real life are a reflection of Hollywood. Stereotypes, can't help it, they're the majority.

@TED -- Not wishing war and devastation (though I'd like that, and call me immature and all things white wink.gif ), but in what I said, there's no wishing, just a suggestion of a "cure".
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