Any Shadow Hearts fans here? Just wondering because a lot of people I know have never heard of this series. =/

I think there are quite a few people on Dreamers who like Shadow Hearts (either that, or a small number of people made many posts in the Shadow Hearts topics I've seen). Either way, I'm one of them. Shadow Hearts is a great series imo, although the third game isn't as good as the previous installments. Of course, Yuri is a hottie with an interesting personality. And a combination of good looks and a good attitude is always a plus. xP Ahem, anyways: Shadow Hearts Covenant is my favorite. Great story, great villains, great music, and let's just pretend the Men Festival doesn't exist. =P

i am a big fan of the 2nd game, never played the first and the third one was pitiful..

Fan as well. The first one I found alright, the second one was simply amazing and the third one somewhat disappointed me, from what I had played.

I thought the first Shadow Hearts is better than Convenant. I prefer Shadow Hearts style to that of Convenant. Have not tried the third so I cannot comment on it. All in all both Shadow Hearts I have played is awesome and it is a great series. Hopefully there will be a game for this generation of consoles.

I liked the first Shadow Hearts a bit better as well. It was because of two things mainly. The dark end-of-the-world atmosphere that was present in the first game was gone in the second. Also gone was badass Yuri, which is something I remember some people complained about when the second game was released. Although I think they're both great games, and are both among my favorite PS2 rpg's. Especially good about the second game was Karin, and her story. Although for a certain reason that I'm sure a lot of people know what I'm referring to, that was also one of the worst things in the story. Still, she carried the game's story imo, and for that she's my favorite character in the game.

I'll never understand what's so great about Karin. I highly dislike her, though I can't quite pinpoint the reason. There's something about her personality that bugs me. She's just so... I dunno, "lame"? No, that's not the word I'm looking for. I wish I could describe it better. But she certainly didn't carry the game for me, she got on my nerves more than anything. Like the scene where she's crying outside the lab door when they're trying to revive Alice. I guess I'm supposed to feel sorry for her at that point, but my only reaction was: "Piss off, bitch!" Ah well, I'm just weird like that.

It is because you're biased to Alice, that is why you don't like her. I think we had this discussion before, about the whole "love" thing and whatever.
As Hiku said, Karin was the one carrying the game hands down. She had an amazing personality, a very deep and dreadfull story and I do know what Hiku is talking about, a horrible destiny/ending, because the director is a ##### idiot.

Some might say that Yuri from Shadow Hearts 1 was better, because he was badass. However, I disagree with this. He was funnier in Shadow Hearts 1, but I found his character in Shadow Hearts 2 so much deeper than in Shadow Hearts 1, due to events in SH1.
Anyway, in SH2 he showed an amazing amount of emotion that wasn't portrayed well in SH2, or at least not as good.
His story with Karin was also very emotional and made the game what it is now. I can't think anyone not mentioning this one way, or another.

So, even though Shadow Hearts 1 was a good game, it will never come close to Shadow Hearts: Covenant's melodramatic and surreal story. Sure, it wasn't as dark as the first one, it was still dark. All it did was lighten the mood a little bit and I can't see anything wrong with that.

Part of that is true, but even with Alice out of the picture, Karin still annoys me. Her personality is so... "lame softie"-ish. I just don't like her; never have, never will.


However, with this I fully agree. I like Yuri só much better in Covenant. In the first game, sometimes he was a little too badass. For example: he punches Halley in the face when the poor kid is considering to give up. I specifically remember that scene because Yuri stood out as an *sshole in that one. In Covenant, he would never do such a thing. He has become more sympathising (is that a word?). Me like.

If you people saw my score page in SH2, you'd think I was crazy.. lets just say I have 25,000+ total hits, 1067 battles and 6021 successful judgment rings, and 2500 perfect judgment rings, and have the number 1 rank. Karin is lvl88 and I solo with her now. Using Yuri and his "ultimate fusion" was lol too, you can't lose with it period. But fighting to get the ultimate was truely a task. . . Did every single thing in that game including killing the Tin Lion and Solomon. It all started with Koudelka. Long before I even knew that it was the first game in the series.

I recently started up SH3 and going to try and learn the game a bit better. I had to cheat last time because I was getting smoked by monsters. Double combos are no fun when it happens to you all the time and never have enough stock to reduce their stock. It definitley has the second best opening in the serious(it basically starts off with a boss fight and one of the better BGMs in the game). And I wish the main character had more SP lol.

My thoughts on Karin was, well you know. . . She's Anne reincarnated. AKA YURI'S MOTHER >_> enough said. I liked Alice and all, but it was like the game was trying to send the message of "Don't move on. Stay hooked on a dead lover". They did with Yuri in what has only been seen thus far since I've been playing RPGs, with Ryudo and the main character from Iris 2 - he stayed cool, stayed cocky and didn't degenerate into an emophied souped down version of himself halfway through the game. Even in the graveyard where he can't open the door of desires he falls down and screams BITE ME!!!!!!!!!! lol. Granted there were some touchy moments but his emotions were appropriate for them.

Well like I said, I thought she carried the story. Take her out, and what's left? Chase the villain? A hero that mopes around all the time and never opens up again? Pretty much every aspect of the story that made the game interesting, she was a part of. More so than Yuri in most cases I found, which is why she was my favorite character. That and because she was an awesome character.
If you think it would still have been fine without her, then I think you may have missed a major point of the journey. Because much of it was seemingly seen from her perspective. It was obvious from the start because Yuri, the main character, is now closed off and comes off as a mystery, while she was very open from the start, and she's the one that starts building up his character again. It starts off that way, and it ends that way, with her tying together Shadow Hearts 1 and 2 in a very certain way in the end. If you take her away then the direction and point of the game becomes unfocused.



Hahaha. Man, I freakin love Yuri. That kid needed to wake up.

On that note, the game starts with Karin as well and disc 1 has a Karin picture.

LOL, will you guys just accept the ending already? It was genius. =) Sure, it's not the kind of ending any of us (myself included) would've initially wanted, but I gotta give the director props for coming up with something so thought-provoking and unexpected. The way it was set up over the course of the game was the main thing that I liked about it, because when you piece everything together, it was just so amazingly well thought out.

And lets face it, it left way more of an impact on us than your typical "happily ever after" ending. =p

.... weren't you the one who liked the plot twist in Star Ocean 3? If so, nuff said.

I didn't like it specifically for the plot twist, but rather because the story finally went into a more sci-fi direction like what I expected from the earlier part(s) of the game. And the whole 4D space thing really wasn't that bad in its own right. =p

I would complain, but I have no right to do so, because in games and movies I seem to have a thing for bitchy women. Miang, Orgulla, Yunalesca, Veronica, etc. etc. Bitchy women are so cool for some reason, maybe because it makes them more manly? xD Ahem, but that's besides the point. I just thought Yuri crossed the line in that scene (only bitchy women can get away with that!).

the first one was good.
the second was great (though i still hold the first one in higher regard)

The third one had a lot wrong with it...
1> Characters sucked.
2> story seemed rushed and incomplete.
3> Shania only had four fusions. [compared to Yuri, who had three per element, then add Amon/Neo-Amon, and the Seraphim.]
4> Frank was a pathetic Joachim knock-off. [forced humor = bad]
5> Hilda had the lamest gimmick for a Valentine. [Keith was just Keith, Joachim alternated between bat/invisible/normal and Mask form... Hilda had to waste a turn to suck up minute quantities of Calories to alternate forms... oy.]
6> *It was neither confirmed, nor denied, that Killer was/was not Yuri, from the "Amnesia" ending of Covenant. Killer looked too much like Yuri to deny the fact, it is a possibility.*
7> Johnny only had a max of 3 strike zones... which is lame, at least give him four. Three strikezones are for characters with low attack power and a preference for magic. (like Geppetto and Lucia)

many more. FtNW was definitely a disappointment.
i'm currently in the middle of my second run-through of FtNW and already i'm tired of it.

Well I guess that could be debated. Yuri in Shadow Hearts 1 had a lot of layers. He also had a more serious side that came out around the time the masks started threatening to take Alice. But being badaass and funny also adds to the depth of the character. Especially if that's not all there is to him, unlike say... Cloud Strife. At first Yuri may have come off that way, but the fact that he doesn't go through a "life changing event" and magically change into someone "nice" (like for example Luke from Tales of the Abyss) means that this is a part of Yuri that compliments his good side, and is there for a purpose. Not as an excuse to make his soft side more sympathetic when we finally get to see it, but the opposite. That even his "badass side" comes from something good. When he punched Halley, he didn't do it to be a jerk, but because he knew that the kid needed to wake up and face reality. And Yuri was a young boy once as well, and he knows they're tough. It was more an emotional punch than a physical.
He had more to him than just a serious side. And all his layers makes him a more diverse character.

Yuri in Shadow Hearts 2, in the important scenes, was a more emotional character though. For example when he started kicking that Japanese guy in that one scene. But even though he was this way, he kept it on the inside for the most part. But I think that's where Karin's part in the story comes in, and why Yuri acting that way still worked, and was interesting.



It's just a matter of preference. Both games were good, but the end-of-the-world theme really did a lot for the first game's atmosphere.




Remember getting to that first village with Alice? The whole time I was there, I knew something was wrong. It gave me the creeps. And the woman you see in the mirror in the haunted village? That was as freaky. Not to mention when Alice encountered Albert Simon, all alone, in the monastery. There was always a feeling that something was going on.
I missed that dark sense of urgency.



Another thing I missed was Yuri's coat. While I liked his outfit in the second game, I liked his coat a lot more.

You're debating a personal opinion? Lol.

Anyway, to sum my thoughts up, I found Yuri in SH2 more appealing, because he showed more emotion. You give a nice meaning to Yuri's soccer punch, but in general, a big part of the game it was the "I don't care type", or him trying to hook up to Alice. I am not saying that Yuri was bad in SH1, I quite enjoyed him, I just found him a better character in SH2, for example because of the scene you mentioned, or the *revival of Alice* and the comical value of him, such as him getting a deadly motion sickness and the scene with Yuri and Alice in a conversation on that bench.




I do like the dark atmosphere, I never said that I didn't. The first village was indeed very eerie, especially when you find out what is going on.

Anyway, I also liked the atmosphere in SH2, which was still dark, albeit less than SH1 and had more comical value, which I really liked.
For example, the scene with Blanca being called Snowball and when Yuri takes the mick of Nicolai when he's in his demon form.



Yeah, I missed his coat as well. Speaking of his clothing, one thing was rather odd. Why is it, that his ultimate armour, which you don't get until the END of the game is the jacket you're already wearing? It really doesn't make any sense and I think they should have kept his coat.

Oh NOES! QUOTE WARS!

So who here played and enjoyed Koudelka? I loved that game, seriously. I don't think I've ever played an RPG so dark before and probably never will.

The game wasn't perfect, far far from it. The battle system, the growth system and generally the whole gameplay was flawed heavily (not enough to make the game unplayable, but it makes the game fall very short). However there were some things I really did enjoy which were sadly taken out for Shadow Hearts.

Firstly the atmosphere, the first Shadow hearts kept it somewhat but it was no where near as dark. Patrick's Diary which detailed exactly what they did to make the mansion the way it was is deliciously disturbing. The monsters were grotesque abominations. The whole storyline was far more edgier. Also name me one other game where the main character is a Gypsy Prostitute.

Next, the Survival Horror aspects of the game. I'm not sure if I'm alone in this, but I loved the idea that you were left to fend for yourself inside this giant mansion complex. Weapons broke and you couldn't go to a shop and buy some more. You have to make do with what you found around you. I think there should have been more then one difficulty level though because at times I found it there were too much items and weapons. That being said, It's very hard to start a new game. I honestly think an RPG set inside just one building (well several all connected it seems) is genius.

Although I enjoy the comedy in the Shadow Hearts series it was great to see a game with no humour but real people (although some of the arguments between Edward and James were funny). It wasn't bogged down with story or character development but any that they did have was done very naturally. These weren't three strangers who within an hour become best friends like in most RPGs but instead are always somewhat distant from each other. There is a distinct feeling that as much as they are working together, their own survival is the priority. It's a trait that Shadow hearts continued somewhat, but was never as strong or natural as in Koudelka.

Also how refreshing is it to find an RPG that doesn't deal with the destruction of the world, or saving a nation ect. ect.

Honestly, I'd love to see Koudelka remade with SH:C's battle system. They would need the same amazing Voice Actors.


I was on the edge of my seat that whole thing. There are few Villains that could have pulled off that scene.

a "friend" is currently "borrowing" my copy of Koudelka. (haven't seen him at work in a while and lost his cell number. it was a $20 game so i'm not complaining much)

Koudelka was a good game. loved the voice acting, but the combat left much to be deisred.

I haven't played the SH, only SH2:covenant and only halfway of SH:ftnw

I loved everything in SH2. that I haven't played SH made the mystic about Alice just alot more interesting.
I think every topic about SH2 contain atleast some discussion about Karin, I think she was a very important part of the game and belive the game wouldn't be as half as good without her!

ps. I belive this topic has wandered outside what it topic! ds.

In what way? As far as I can tell we're all talking about the Shadow Hearts series in some way. Unless you are referring to Koudelka, which is actually part of the Shadow Heart series.

Koudelka was the first game made, it flopped somewhat so they reinvented the series in the form of Shadow Hearts but SH is actually a sequel as it shares locations and characters. Events from Koudelka are referenced.

If you are referring to the Quote wars between Pes and Atty... well... that's just normal.

Even the quotes are related to Shadow Hearts, as that is the topic of the posts.

Anyhoo, I played Koudelka as well. Good game, it is like playing a Resident Evil RPG. Am I kidding?
What other horror games have this message: "the door is locked from the other side", or how about acquiring ammo? Look for red boxes on the floor. First weapon? A gun even x'D.
So yeah, Koudelka is a RE RPG.

I had heard that it was very influenced by Resident Evil, and I'd love to see an RPG do it again. As I said, the survival aspects of Koudelka were a big part of why I liked it. Of course a lot of fear was taken out because before anything could actually harm you there was a transition between the normal screen and the battle screen.

Yeah it is an RE RPG, but it done it well, except for the RPG elements... I would have imagined it would be the other way round.

I was suggesting at this first post in this topic, not that it matters really!

I'm a believer of Shadow Hearts.

But I also didn't like From the New World. If it wasn't a Shadow Hearts game, it would have been ignored altogether.

I saw Koudelka on a rack at a used game store. I almost bought it on the spot, just to have it. I almost regret my ultimate decision not to.

Anyway, Shadow Hearts is ballstastic. The wars over which is better between SH and SH:C are rather heated. Which is to be expected, I suppose, when two games in the series feature such a difference in style. I personally enjoyed SH:C more, mostly due to the huge upgrade in the gameplay department.

Still haven't gotten around to playing From the New World, though. I plan on playing through Covenant again before even touching FtNW. Which is probably a bad idea, considering how inferior the latter is to the former.

Yea that part of the game gave the word "eerie" a whole new meaning. I like the out of nowhere boss fight(seen in pic) too.

The only thing I haven't done still is beat Seraphic Radiance. Haven't even fought it. They did a good job in making the good ending difficult to obtain. It did not feel good having Alice killed by the big ass eye thing in the graveyard. The judgment ring was hard to see, I don't think I EVER got a perfect in SH1.

I hated the requirements to get the good ending in that game. Seriously, that's pretty much impossible to get unless you follow a guide. Eh, I still did it though, the only time I played the game through to the end.

Even as dated as the first SH game is, it's still really fun to play. That said, I don't think I'll ever get around to doing it again, sadly.

*spoilers*




Yes, I used a guide for that too. But I remember I got stuck anyway: the guide said to examine Alice's tombstone, so I did this when Alice reached the place. Turns out you have to examine the tombstone as Yuri, but the guide didn't say that! Of course, looking back on it now it makes more sense that Yuri appears to help her when he saw the tombstone and not just her. Oh well.

Yeah I guess that would be normal, since you can only debate opinions. You can't debate facts. lol

And I was just saying that it's debatable what constitutes as more deep. In SH 1 Yuri has more layers to his character, and all that adds to the depth of his character. Being emotional is only one side of a character. And although he had some more sides to him than that, it mostly revolved around that in SH2. (For obvious reasons.)
I thought mixing "good" and "bad" made SH1 Yuri very interesting. Most games that have a "bad" main character often have them go through some transformation and change them. For Luke in Tales of Abyss, that side of him was something he later became ashamed of, as he changed. But Yuri never really changed in that way, but we accepted all sides of him as part of his awesome personality.


Yuri and Alice on the bench? I only remember Yuri and Karin on a bench.
Anyway, I enjoyed those scenes with Yuri a lot, since you got to find out more about his personality. But I liked seeing more sides to him, so I prefered SH1 Yuri. And because his badass side was so awesome. lol


SH2 had some darker themes going on as well, like what happened to Kawashima. But I since SH1 took it to such a high level, almost a little Silent Hill like, it stands out that way since I can't think of many other rpg's with that theme. And since it worked well the first time, people were a bit disappointed that it didn't return for the second game. But as mentioned before, the second game was still a good game regardless.


Yeah. There's a Directors Cut of Shadow Hearts 2. I forgot if there were additional outfits for them in that game or not. Would have been awesome if you could find Yuri's coat as his final armor.

I didn't found Yuri's bad ass side interesting, actually. It was funny and the soccer punch did made me laugh, but I wasn't thinking of him as an "onion", in that he has many layers and such.



Dammit, that was a stupid mistake. I indeed meant Karin.



I think Koudelka was the one that was the most like that. It even used famous Resident Evil technics, such as the famous "the door appears to be locked from the other side".



Negative. The European version is the only version that has access to the debug island and you can select all the items in there.
I know that the director's cut items where there, as I got Veronica's outfit and weapon, as well as the other characters, such as Lenny and the infamous Kupa/Panda weapon for Yuri.
However, his coat isn't there. Stupid shits.

Disagreed.
1. Besides having to bring up a new cast instead of reusing from the older games, it worked pretty well with them.
2. Seemed.
3. Better to have a couple of fusions that you use all of instead of massive amounts which you hardly use any of.
4. Each game had the comedy sidekick in the same style, and it was no different here. As much as I refused to let him in my party, he was amusing.
5. Awwww, those kind of things are surely the defining reason to or not to get the game, right?.
7. Johnny was the only character that (apart from the story), the game could have left out =)



You do realize the contradiction here, right?

I agree that FTNW is rushed. I guess if you were to count the side quests the game is about 30hrs long. Without them though, going from the beginning to the "gate" is about 10-15hrs.